[wesp5]

Remaining on the todo list are the following:

What about the effect enhancements? If you don't want to include the ones from Slasher, you should at least consider my own improvements which I uploaded here earlier. If some of these go to far for your taste, I think at least the yellow Drazi beams and green Nial beams should be included, because both are clearly canon and are done with modified picture files only without any table editing which was necessary for some of the others...

[FUBAR-BDHR]

What do those have to do with a remain ship todo list?

[wesp5]

What do those have to do with a remain ship todo list?

I thought this was your complete Zathtras todo list !

[FUBAR-BDHR]

Found several small issues.  Uploading Zathras 2.5c.  Should be up in about an hour.  This will most likely be the last version before the release version to go with 3.6.16.   

[wesp5]

This will most likely be the last version before the release version to go with 3.6.16.   

So what about the beam effects I mentioned above for the release version?

[FUBAR-BDHR]

Not planning on adding anything else for this release.  Need to cut off features at some point and since 3.6.16 is now in RC stage this is a good time.  Only bugfixes will be added until after release. 

[wesp5]

Not planning on adding anything else for this release.

May I ask you why? Because the beam effects are already finished, are miniscule in size, can't produce any bugs because they are cosmetically only and I have clearly shown that they are canon! Who knows how long it will be until another Zathras final will be released? I have the impression you just won't accept them because I am not one of the old regulars here ...

[FUBAR-BDHR]

Because adding things like this takes time and testing and I just don't have time to put towards that and getting all the necessary bug fixes done.  I didn't even get through all of emi_100's maps.  Zathras was created to fix bugs and that is the priority.  Anything else like changing effects or adding features is secondary. 

[wesp5]

Because adding things like this takes time and testing and I just don't have time to put towards that and getting all the necessary bug fixes done.

But there is no bug fixing involved in these cases: the Nial black-and-white sprite has just been turned slightly green and the Drazi sprite has been turned yellow instead of red. Even if you would want to use my other changes, one look at the sprites or tables would show whether they are okay or not. These are only effects!

Zathras was created to fix bugs and that is the priority.

Wrong beam colours compared to the show are quite obvious bugs to me !

[Vidmaster]

While I never liked this fact too, I would not speak of a "bug"

[wesp5]

While I never liked this fact too, I would not speak of a "bug"

Maybe, but what I don't understand is that FUBAR and you others put so many effort into fixing model details that only few people will ever notice and any newbie like myself can barge in and wonder why some beam colors are still wrong after all these years. And that although they are quite easy to fix!

[Vidmaster]

When a ship turret shoots through the vessels own hull (which many do), this does not only completely take you out of the game, it is also kind of unfair and breaks balancing. Plus IT DOES NOT MAKE SENSE :-)

[IPAndrews]

It's a code bug. On large ships it's perfectly plausible for a turret to be able to shoot the ship on which it's mounted. Only it wouldn't do so because it would be monumentally dumb. The solution is fix the code so that the turret checks for friendly obstructions before shooting. Not forcing designers to nerf the turrets by changing the models.

[wesp5]

The solution is fix the code so that the turret checks for friendly obstructions before shooting.

I agree, but isn't there some kind of movement restriction for model turrets so they can't shoot, like say, down into the ship they are sitting on? Or some kind of angle restriction for beam weapons that tell them they can only fire like forward and maybe a maximum of 45% up, down, left or right?

And while this is the first time I meet one of the First Ones here , don't you think Zathras should correct canonical issues like the Drazi or Nials firing wrong beam colors? Especially when this is really easy to correct? The game is called The Babylon Project after all for a reason, isn't it ?

[niffiwan]

It's a code bug. On large ships it's perfectly plausible for a turret to be able to shoot the ship on which it's mounted. Only it wouldn't do so because it would be monumentally dumb. The solution is fix the code so that the turret checks for friendly obstructions before shooting. Not forcing designers to nerf the turrets by changing the models.

I thought the "check hull" subsystem flag could do that now?

[IPAndrews]

Good stuff. Kindly explain to the Zathras team how it works. Problem solved. My work here is done.

[FUBAR-BDHR]

Check hull only goes so far.  If the fov is wrong the turret will still rotate to face a taget it can't shoot at and in some cases clip the hull of the ship in doing so.  This prevents it from picking valid targets.  In other cases turrets were set up incorrectly with the barrels and firing points pointing down the fvec instead of the uvec and/or not having the proper fvec/uvec values defined. 

[Slasher]

I experimented with the check hull flag on the EA Phalanx guns long ago and noticed they still seemed to fire through the Omega's rotating section.  I dunno if that was model data or the engine though.

[FUBAR-BDHR]

I believe the omega has some collision detection issues on the rotating section as parts of it are outside the bounding box of detail0.