[Zacam]

In mv_effects-wep.tbm, is there a reason the @ in front of of the weapons are not there? If it's supposed to update the fields for weapons.tbl, shouldn't the $Name's match? Also, the name for Subach HL-7D is just Subach HL-D.

I also note some discrepancy between weapons.tbl values for Hull/Shield values, are the ones in the TBM supposed to be corrections?

Also, between the PCX and TGA versions of files, do both need to exist and if not, can the PCX's be deleted safely?

[Zacam]

Using Taylors fixes, most missiles in loadout now spin on thier centers, except for the Harpoon, Trebuchet, StilettoII and Helios. What's interesting is that in F3, all of the missiles BUT those are NOT spinning on their centers. (With the exceptions of the Hornet and the Cyclops, these both spin on center in both locations.) There are no _tech.pof's for either the Hornet or the Belial (Cyclops) which led me to test something. I removed all occurances of the following from mv_missiles-wep.tbm and mv_models-wep.tbm (which were then placed in mediavps\data\tables):

$Tech Model:   crossbow_tech.pof
$Tech Model:   stilettoII_tech.pof
$Tech Model:   trebuchet_tech.pof
$Tech Model:   helios_tech.pof

And now the Harpoon, StilettoII, Trebuchet and Helios join the Hornet and Cyclops on center spinning in F3 and Loadout. (Note, I used the POF's from taylors updates, I have not tested these against the regular mediavp's POF's.) I did however test by also deleting the _tech.pof files, just to make sure.

Whew. Now to knock out why the Rockeye, Tempest, Tornado, Tag A/B/C, Piranha and Infyrno don't spin on center in F3 (without breaking the loadout spin on center) and I'll be a damn happy person.

BTW, what is the newhornet.pof for?

[taylor]

Whew. Now to knock out why the Rockeye, Tempest, Tornado, Tag A/B/C, Piranha and Infyrno don't spin on center in F3 (without breaking the loadout spin on center) and I'll be a damn happy person.

I did that on purpose.  Those missile still have no autocenter data, even though I can fake it with my code fixes.  In the loadout screens it will be faked it the data doesn't exist in the model but I didn't set it to fake the data in the lab (F3) so that we can still tell at a glance which models need to be fixed.

[Zacam]

Ahh. That make sense. Presumably so that if/when someone makes actual 3D models of them those could be used instead.

Well, I always figured the best way to learn something was to dive right in.....I only have Lightwave right now and I just got Photoshop (finally) so I'll see what I can churn out. Given that there are of projects and I'm sure people have to be tired of doing "vanilla" FS/FS2 conversions I'm willing to lend a hand.

Quick question: I've noted for of ships that there are usually 2/3 primary texture files. Let's use the HTL Fenris as an example. It has 3 dds textures, 3 dds shine and 3 dds glows. (They all don't match in size. Neither do the Argos.) Presumably 3 exist because there are 3 LOD's (and then debris makes 4). Would it be more efficient/effective/work to make a single primary of each (texture, shine, glow, debris) and just mipmap them in a single dds file apiece? I'm _very_ familiar with DDS with mod's for Morrowind and  modeling/texturing from doing Total Annihilation and Freelancer, but I'm not entirely sure how SCP would handle that, since I haven't found any like that.

(Still curious about newhornet.pof. Can't find anything that calls to it. Also, how many Hornet_Bitmap.pcx files are there supposed to be and what's the _actual_ location that file is supposed to be in? I guess textures\maps. And yeah, I'm just going through and "house cleaning" a personal set of the VP's to get a feel for everything.)

[taylor]

Quick question: I've noted for of ships that there are usually 2/3 primary texture files. Let's use the HTL Fenris as an example. It has 3 dds textures, 3 dds shine and 3 dds glows. (They all don't match in size. Neither do the Argos.) Presumably 3 exist because there are 3 LOD's (and then debris makes 4). Would it be more efficient/effective/work to make a single primary of each (texture, shine, glow, debris) and just mipmap them in a single dds file apiece? I'm _very_ familiar with DDS with mod's for Morrowind and  modeling/texturing from doing Total Annihilation and Freelancer, but I'm not entirely sure how SCP would handle that, since I haven't found any like that.

Yeah, everyone is supposed to use mipmaps rather than different textures for each LOD.  But, not everyone knew that was possible at the time those models were made, and the code for using mipmaps properly wasn't aways there either.  There is a sticky thread I made which has info on how best to create textures for models to reduce memory usage and improve performance.  Most new models, and some fixed versions of old models, use that info as a basic guide.

(Still curious about newhornet.pof. Can't find anything that calls to it. Also, how many Hornet_Bitmap.pcx files are there supposed to be and what's the _actual_ location that file is supposed to be in? I guess textures\maps. And yeah, I'm just going through and "house cleaning" a personal set of the VP's to get a feel for everything.)

There is a newhornet.pof and a new_hornet.pof, both are the same.  Just look in the tables (and don't forget to look in the retail tbls) to figure out exactly which one is used and delete the other one.  That's what I did, though I can't remember right now which was the one to keep. (I want to say to keep newhornet.pof and delete the other one, but you had better double check that).

I think that hornet_bitmap is just the missile trail, so there only needs to be one and it needs to be in data/effects.

[Kaboodles]

How come the -ambient_factor flag doesn\'t work anymore?

[CP5670]

Now that you mention it, I think I've been getting that too. I noticed a few weeks ago that the ships were looking a bit darker than how I'm used to seeing them, and changing the ambient factor seemed to have no effect.

[Kaboodles]

That\'s the opposite of what I wanted.  I actually used it to darken the ships (which makes them look much better IMO), but it has no effect now and all the ships are bright again.

[Zacam]

If ambient_factor or any other flags don't seem to work, create a new pilot and then restart. Sounds strange, yes, but I initially had that problem a while back myself when running tests. I was swapping between CVS and RC builds and at some point it stoped applying certain settings until I created a new pilot, at which point those settings worked again.

Also, settings problems would be better handled in either the exe thread or in the launcher thread, since it's those two items (and not the vp's) that control the effect of said settings.

[Kaboodles]

Never mind, I fixed the problem.  I had env mapping on in Direct3D mode, which made the lighting a lot stronger than it should have been.

I know everyone says you should run in OpenGL mode, but OpenGL always gives me these weird graphical bugs, like boxes around lights and engine thrust effects and some weird white-washing effect on a bunch of the huge warships.  What am I doing wrong?  I really want to try env mapping, but the white-washing is so icky!

[Zacam]

Are you running an ATI card? If so, try selecting -disable_fbo ("Disable OpenGL Render Targets" in "Troubleshooting" on the Features Tab in the Launcher), also try setting (if it isn't already) in the Experimental Tab "Use Specular Alpha for Env Mapping".

Also, if you're running 3.6.8 Zeta MediaVP's, do be sure to grab (From page 5 of the Release Thread for the MediaVP's) Taylors 0710 MediaVP Patches.

[Kaboodles]

I am running an ATI card, but none of the things you mentioned fixed the problem.  It\'s really weird, as you can see every triangle in the models, as if they weren\'t textured or something.

[Kaboodles]

A picture of my OpenGL problem:

[Zacam]

What exe build are you using? Cuz that (to me atleast) it a mighty strange issue.

[taylor]

Try using the -noibx option.  I've heard from a couple of people that this type of thing can happen when using IBX files, even known good ones, but the actual cause has never been found.  And it only seems to affect a very small handful of people.

[S-99]

The hecate looks very nice even untextured

[Kaboodles]

-Zacam

In the screenshot I\'m using taylor\'s lighting build from the muzzle flash thread, but it seems to happen with any build I use.

-taylor

The IBX thing didn\'t work =(

-S-99

It\'s not really untextured.  It\'s some sort of crazy lighting problem.  It might also be worth mentioning that turning off specular lighting makes this happen to all the models, and turning light detail down on the FS2 options removes the problem for some of the models, namely the Deimos.

[Zacam]

Hmmm. So, if i may ask, what ATI card are you running? And what Catalyst (or otherwise) drivers are you using on it?

Operating system and other systems specifications might also be handy if you could feel free to divulge them.

You say it's happening with other builds as well, do you mean other RC builds, or does it also include the redmenace CVS builds? (Or have you compiled a build from cvs yourself?)

When you turn off specular mapping, are Glowmaps and Environment (misspelled as evironment) Mapping enabled? Is Use specular alpha for env mapping enabled?

Rather, to make the above questions easier to answer, please post the full list of commands listed in the "Features" tab of the launcher.

Piecemeal information isn't so handy a thing when there can be any number of reasons behind an issue and this would indeed be an issue (however localized to you it may be, it might yet happen to others.) Finding out how and why and getting it solved would be rather nice, I think.

And even though sounds and graphics are two seperate things entirely, it should probably be asked wether you are running with OpenAL (prefferably the latest version located towards the bottom of the page as an "Attachment") installed?

[Kaboodles]

AMD Athlon XP 2500+
1 gig of ram
ATI Radeon 9600 w/ 128 MB memory
Windows 2000
Not sure about drivers, it\'s sorta just the default one I guess

I used RC2 and Taylors lighting build.  I was actually wrong about specular.  It\'s turning off glowmaps that screws them all up, and the combination of flags makes no difference when glowmaps are off.  All ships are messed up.

This is everything in the features tab:

D:\\FS2\\FS2\\fs2_open_3_6_9.exe -mod FSPort -spec -glow -env -2d_poof -missile_lighting -dualscanlines -targetinfo -orbradar -rearm_timer -ship_choice_3d -3dwarp -snd_preload -alpha_env -fps  -ambient_factor 65 -spec_point 5.0 spec_tube 5.0 -spec_static 4.0 -spec_exp 22

I did the weird -spec_point/tube stuff when I didn\'t notice any dramatic changes in lighting with beams and laser blobs.

I am also running OpenAL, as I needed it to fix the \"Failed to read flags\" error or whatever it was.

[DaBrain]

Default drivers... that means they might be really outdated by now.

Try getting new drivers from ATI. There is only a small chance this will fix the problem, but it's worth a try.