Author Topic: Sony GDM-5410  (Read 3176 times)

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Offline ZylonBane

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My old 21" flatscreen monitor is dying (streaking and uncorrectable red tint).

I'm not ready to make the LCD plunge quite yet. The usual reasons-- latency, insufficiently black blacks, and fuzzy interpolation of non-native resolutions.

Time for a new CRT then, right? But for some reason 21" monitors are almost twice as expensive as 19" monitors. And dammit, I'm used to that 21" expanse.

Well hey, what about a used monitor? The one I have now is used (paid $100 for it), and it lasted great for years. So I turn to eBay, and find dozens of listings for Sun/Sony 21" GDM-5410 Trinitron flat CRT monitors. Average going price around $75. Seems to be just what I'm looking for!

So my question to the HLP collective is this: Anyone else used one of these things?
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Offline CP5670

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I had one of those where I worked last summer and it was probably the worst monitor I've ever used; extremely blurry, with warped geometry, convergence all over the place and horrible black levels. The refresh rates aren't too great for a 21" either. That seemed to be a particularly bad unit though. There was also a GDM-5510 and an F520 there, both of which looked far better.

See if you can get one of the newer extended brightness CRTs instead, like the FE2111SB or FP2141SB / 2070SB (what I have), which look dramatically better than other CRTs (or monitors of any kind, for that matter) in games.

If you're buying monitors off ebay, it's a good idea to try and find a local seller, which will let you both forego shipping costs (and the significant risk of shipping damage) and check out the unit in person before buying. The condition of used and refurbed CRTs can really vary a lot and it's good to know exactly what you're getting before taking the plunge.

 

Offline Fury

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Eh? The current generation LCD's beat CRT's in every aspect. Latency has been low enough for years not to show any ghosting, I have 12ms LCD and no ghosting, the latest LCD's are 4ms, maybe even as low as 2ms. Also, if you get a quality LCD any fuzzyness when using non-native resolutions is quite limited. Also black is close enough in quality LCD's.

There's absolutely no reasons not to go with an LCD unless you're using graphics applications that require extreme color correctness, but there are professional displays meant for that anyway.

 

Offline Col. Fishguts

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I have the 19' version of the Sun/Sony Trinitron, got it in mint condition off ebay for ~65$. For all I know it's as good as any Trinitron I've ever used (which IMO are good CRTs).
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Offline CP5670

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Quote
Eh? The current generation LCD's beat CRT's in every aspect. Latency has been low enough for years not to show any ghosting, I have 12ms LCD and no ghosting, the latest LCD's are 4ms, maybe even as low as 2ms. Also, if you get a quality LCD any fuzzyness when using non-native resolutions is quite limited. Also black is close enough in quality LCD's.

There's absolutely no reasons not to go with an LCD unless you're using graphics applications that require extreme color correctness, but there are professional displays meant for that anyway.

You have evidently never seen a good CRT. :p I got the 4ms rated NEC 90GX2 LCD for my other computer recently (which is considered to be the third fastest LCD currently available, just behind the VX922 and 20WMGX2) and the ghosting problem is more serious than I had earlier thought. The motion blur in D2X-XL is bad enough to make me feel a little dizzy after playing for less than five minutes. Although it's much less noticeable in some other games. I got it mainly for text and windows programs, for which it works very well aside from the screen door effect, but I'm glad I don't need to use it for games or graphics in general.

Black on many LCDs looks decent in the daytime (in fact, it looks excellent with the glossy coating LCDs) but it's terrible in a dark room, and I have seen quite a few with supposedly high contrast ratios and/or low brightness. I do most of my gaming in the nighttime with the lights off and this makes a difference to me.

There is only one current LCD that I would say is comparable to the top CRTs in still, daytime image quality, the NEC 20WMGX2. It costs far more than other 20" LCDs though and still falls short of good CRTs in other respects, like resolution, refresh rates, motion blur and nighttime black level.

Find me an LCD that can output a solid 100fps with no blurring or input lag, does 2048x1536 or more, displays perfect black in a dark room, has locally uniform colors (i.e. no screen door effect), shows gradients smoothly with no banding and costs $700 or less. I'll buy it right away. :D There are LCDs that do all but the first thing (some of which cost several thousand dollars), but no one LCD that does them all.

All that being said, if I was buying a gaming monitor today I wouldn't even consider a CRT (that 20WMGX2 would be an automatic choice). All the good CRTs have long since been discontinued, and the only ones still available new are pretty much all garbage. Refurbed and used ones have a high chance of having problems and usually aren't readily available locally.

I can't wait for some new display tech to come out. We've been hearing about OLED and SED for quite some time now but there is nothing on the immediate horizon yet.

 

Offline pecenipicek

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i got an AOC 9Klr, which apart from a bit emphasized blue band(my own preferrence), is veeeery goood in what i need it for. read playing lot of games and doing 3D and graphics.

i was thinking some time earlier about arsing my parents about getting a 19" LCD, but i gave up when i realised all the false ads with 2ms and 4ms response time. real response time on the LCD's you can get without going into 4 digit dollar numbers is rarely below 12 and the most its below is 8ms. i agree, having a LCD monitor would be awesome, but, until the technology gets *VASTLY* better than CRT monitors, i'm sticking to my 19" AOC 9klr
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Offline ZylonBane

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Yeah, one of my favorite games is Thief, which absolutely demands a monitor with proper deep blacks. And hey, cheap used CRTs are a lot easier to find than cheap used LCDs.
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Offline Fury

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I have hard time believing a 4ms response time LCD would show any ghosting, you might have a faulty display there or possibly a poor quality one. I love my Samsung 172X which is a 12ms LCD, I wouldn't trade it for any hulking CRT display. As a matter of fact, I think my next LCD will be either 19" or 20" widescreen LCD. Having used widescreen displays on notebooks, it just doesn't feel the same to use regular displays after the widescreen goodness. :)

 

Offline CP5670

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A bad unit is unlikely to have that kind of problem (dead pixels, backlight bleeding and high pitched RF noises are the usual culprits), and the various 8ms LCDs I have seen much more substantial motion blur anyway. To be fair, I barely even notice it in some games, but there are other games that exhibit it quite badly.

Quote
Yeah, one of my favorite games is Thief, which absolutely demands a monitor with proper deep blacks. And hey, cheap used CRTs are a lot easier to find than cheap used LCDs.

Have you played Thief DS? I haven't gotten around to playing that yet and am thinking of getting a cheap copy off ebay.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2006, 04:05:56 pm by CP5670 »

 

Offline ZylonBane

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I have a copy of it, but am waiting until I upgrade from this ancient ti4200 before playing it. I tried playing the demo on this card and the engine is quite a performance hog.

Based on the demo I probably won't enjoy it much anyway. TDS was heavily consolized, and on top of that just poorly programmed. I don't want flashing beacons on every single piece of loot, dammit!
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Offline Ace

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TDS has some very fun moments. The level sizes being small is my main complaint, but it doesn't prevent a few from being pretty well done. (oil... Hammerite falls into clockgears making nasty sounds ;) )
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Offline aldo_14

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You can get a SDM-E76D.

It has an extended bit for sticking post-it notes.

Y'know, for those of us whose computers sit in the middle of a vast empty desert with no other flat surfaces for miles around, and are incapable of writing stuff on bits of paper and shoving them in our pockets.

 

Offline CP5670

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Quote
I have a copy of it, but am waiting until I upgrade from this ancient ti4200 before playing it. I tried playing the demo on this card and the engine is quite a performance hog.

Based on the demo I probably won't enjoy it much anyway. TDS was heavily consolized, and on top of that just poorly programmed. I don't want flashing beacons on every single piece of loot, dammit!

Sounds like the same story as DXIW. :( I might get it anyway just to see what happens in the story, as it can be found for around $5-10 shipped on ebay these days and my current card handles that engine well.

Did these games even sell that well? For all the things the developers did to increase their mainstream appeal, it seems like their retail prices fell very quickly. I got DXIW for $15 on ebay just two weeks after it came out, and that was pretty much the standard price there. I guess the atrocious performance probably threw off a lot of people. I have seen the Xbox version and it runs just as badly too.

 

Offline Darkage

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I got the same monitor, mine was way to bright with streaking lines in it. Fixed with a hardware modification to lower the G2 output to the tube. And it works perfectly now.

It is a know problem with these screens that the G2 voltage starts to drift over time.

If this is the problem you are having you can do it your self. Not much danger as your not hear the 26kv anode cap:)

Find R463 wich is 100k and use 2 SMD resistors, one of 56k and one 68k makes for 124k.

Lowering the brightness most of the time helps the overly red exposed collor.

Hope it helps, if not then ignore this message:D
« Last Edit: June 13, 2006, 05:46:23 pm by Darkage »
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Offline Colonol Dekker

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