[aldo_14]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/5186614.stm

Many teenage girls see having a baby as a better option than a low-paid "dead-end" job, research has found.

The study, for the Joseph Rowntree Foundation suggested girls as young as 13 choose motherhood to be independent and to create "a loving family".

I can't help but think that 13-22 is a really bad time to be planning exactly what to do with your life.  I mean, fair enough, there's nothing wrong with having kids (assuming you can support them), but particularly at the earlier ages of that range, and if it's a response to low job prospects or the like, it seems too likely to lead to a mistake or regrets; essentially the sentiments echoed in the last few paragraphs of the article.

[vyper]

Indeed. I knew a girl in high school whose only ambition was to have kids one day, but having been brought up in a fairly strict family she never had the freedom to make any "mistakes" (well, none that actually had long term consequences); in the end she qualified as a nurse and is now (afaik) in a rewarding job.

Of course, she did go to the same school as me where almost 70% of graduates went on to Uni; had she been elsewhere (say like the east end of Glasgow) I image the outcome would've been different.

[Colonol Dekker]

Its the norm where i live, I am a career guy. I have no plans to even contemplate fertilising a female. But i have a 22 year old brother with a 17 year old skirt whos due in nearly a month.
And i believe save 2 others, i am the only one without a kid living with them (I have a daughter but thats personal situation so no comment)

[Ghostavo]

 

[Mefustae]

I really didn't need to know that. Any of it. At all. Ever.

[Colonol Dekker]

I really didn't need to know that. Any of it. At all. Ever.

And that was a pointless comment, I was offering a view with evidence to back it up, You spammed.........

[Mefustae]

Spam? Me? You forget yourself, sir. I was merely pointing out the unsettling nature of your post in a humerous fashion. I really have nothing to add to the greater conversation as I believe the choice is entirely up to them.

[Sphynx]

I usually refrain from entering these threads, but I feel compelled to say a few things. Please pardon me if any of it comes off sounding harsh.

In my mind, these young girls are not "choosing motherhood." They are choosing their unrealistic and highly idealized misperception of what life as a single teenage girl with a baby happens to be like.

Don't get me wrong. I am a father, and my wife and I are about to have our second child any day now. Our children have been a wonderfully encriching part of our lives. My wife is now a stay-at-home mom by her own choice, although she is smart enough and talented enough to pursue any career that she may have desired. However, we waited to have children until we were married, committed to each other, and felt that our relationship had enough time to consolidate that we could offer our children a family with a warm and strong marriage at it's core.

In my career, I have seen a lot of these young women, nay, mere girls who have "chosen" motherhood, and I think if most of them really knew what they were getting into, they would certainly think otherwise.

It is sad that in our world young girls are taught to see this as "choosing independence." What they are choosing is most likely a life on wellfare. What they also fail to consider entirely is the situation into which they are bringing the young child.

Becoming a parent should not be a selfish choice, because being a parent requires a degree of unselfishness greater than any other role in life. Parenthood is for adults who are ready to make a committment to the next generation. Parenthood is for mature individuals who are able of conceptualizing what it truly entails. Parenthood is a lifestyle, a highly rewarding one, but one that requires a great deal of focus on someone other than the self.

Having a child to be independent is, quite simply, a total oxymoron! You cannot be "independent" (the vaunted golden idol of many) when you have a small human being that is totally dependent on you for it's very survival.

Independence requires hard work, not mere fertility. And ultimately, independence may be a red herring, because human connection is an innate human need (see all of the research on attachment for an example). Interdependence is necessary and healthy, given that it does not lead to an extreme and fused style of relating to other people.

I feel very sorry for these young girls, for how they have been misguided in this way. However, my deepest sympthies go to their children.

[Flipside]

I agree with you in the main to be honest Sphynx, I am certain a lot of people make this choice with no clue what raising a child actually requires.

I chose never to have children simply because I am in no position to raise them as I would see fit, I don't have the money nor the living space to start raising kids, and even if I did, I'm still far from sure I would want them. Give me a job I can go home from at 5pm and I'm happy, but you can't take a day off from kids

[Sphynx]

It is true that there is no vacation from parenthood.

And I understand and respect what you are saying, Flipside.

For me, though, I have found that I don't want to take a vacation from parenthood (just like I don't want to take a vacation from my marriage). Sure, my wife and I make sure we have time to date without the kids being present, and we have taken a few small vacations without the kids, and that has been a good thing for us.

I will admit that there are days when I am tired and it is a hard thing to have to be the daddy, but like all of my other meaningful relationships, I find that I don't want to get away from parenthood. In fact, I look forward to coming home to it every day.

That's just been my experience.

[aldo_14]

Heh....... it seems almost everyone at my office is awaiting a sprog, nowadays (granted, I am the newest and youngest by a goodly few years).  I don't think I know any people who have kids and regret it, but said people can usually afford the time and cost of having a sprog; that is, it's not something that's just caught them out like a 15 year old getting up the duff because she doesn't understand what parenthood is. 

Albiet for one guy I went to uni with - he was about 28 when he started 1st year - who had 3 kids.  Which sounds kind of nuts, except that a) he absolutely doted on them, and b) he was doing it for their sakes, to get a better paying job etc etc.  Really nice guy, he ended up working down south in Oxford area I think.

Which isn't really an answer, is it?

[Sphynx]

I don't know, aldo, it seemed to be a pretty good answer to me.

I think if we all talk about it and think about it, adults having kids seems to work out pretty well for both parties(as long as said adults aren't abusive, etc).

Kids having kids (and teenagers are still definately kids, even from a strictly biological point of view. In conducive environments, the amount of neurological and cognitive development that occurs between 13 and 20 is astonishing, resulting in qualitatively different thinking), on the other hand, seems to be a recipe for heartbreak and dysfunction.

I think you just noted the antithesis, or perhaps the complementary opposite, of the original topic of the thread. Quite on topic and quite pithy, by my estimation.

[karajorma]

The irony is that the people who weigh up the situation and decide that they shouldn't have children have already revealed themselves to have more of the qualities necessary in a good parent than many of the people who do have one.

[Sphynx]

An excellent point.

I agree that becoming a parent requires that sort of sound reasoning. It is a pity that the biological aspects of reproduction function as well as they do in a manner quite independent of reason. It is sad that those who choose to disregard reason, to act senselessly or selfishly still end up having children. Ultimately, in these cases, it is the child who suffers the most.

Is it not also ironic that a dedicated and mature couple that would make excellent parents can spend years of unsuccessfully trying to become pregnant, while a teenager with her head in the clouds can become so with little effort?

It's a funny universe we live in.

Shifting gears here: there's a great book called "The Intentional Family." I'd recommend it to anyone. It addresses how families are much more likely to be happy and well-functioning if they choices they make in relating to each other are intentional and based on solid reflection, rather than just being allowed to occur by happenstance.

[SadisticSid]

Its the norm where i live, I am a career guy. I have no plans to even contemplate fertilising a female. But i have a 22 year old brother with a 17 year old skirt whos due in nearly a month.
And i believe save 2 others, i am the only one without a kid living with them (I have a daughter but thats personal situation so no comment)

That has to be the funniest thing I've read on here in a while.

Almost as funny as one of my gay friends finding out a fortnight ago that he has a one year-old son by some girl he 'experimented' with. Kudos to him though, at least he's supporting him...

[karajorma]

Hope that's experimented as in "one last hetrosexual fling to see if I'm really gay" rather than "It's alive! ALIVE!!!"

[SadisticSid]

He might've described himself as straight-curious at that point I think

[NGTM-1R]

I think it has to do with a point I've seen made before; after fighting for the right to join the workforce, women have discovered what men have known for centuries: work sucks.

[Turambar]

i blame brittney spears.  enough girls idolized her before, but now all those girls are going to want to grow up and be white trash.

[Getter Robo G]

You forgot the best part...  "And drive around fast food places with baby in the front seat (in lap) no seatbelt.." Way to go Mama Spears..

"Look Baby , you're driving" (Crash!) 

The Paparazzi should not have published the photos but kept them and just walked up to her and slapped her across the face yelling "Stupid twit, CARSEAT!"   And if she complained then use the photos...