Author Topic: RELEASE: Inferno R2  (Read 138374 times)

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Offline SF-Junky

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WARNING! There might be tiny spoilers in this review.

I've finished this mod yesterday. I think this was the first time since playing the original Inferno back in the 2000s - of which I had no fond memories. If I remember correctly, it has nothing more to offer than absurdly large warships and a total lack of any story.

Regarding gameplay, music and assets, this is a top quality mod. I've found a couple of flaws, for instance many radar signs (e.g. for fighters or the Arcadia) have black boxes around them, but that's not really hurtful. The most major thing I've encountered was that Bellum Se Ipsum Alet was kind of broke: the "opening fire" messages from the Vasudan ship played repeatedly and the debriefing showed the same or similar paragraphs repeatedly. It was not mission-breaking, though. Overall, these are child diseases which are okay for an initial release. Regarding gameplay, I'd recommend adding hull repair and the AI could be a little better at avoiding collisions.

Overall, the technology shown in this mod, the ships and weapons feel like a believable extension of the development we have seen between FS1 and FS2, although I felt like there was a little too much stuff, particularly regarding the weapons available to the player. It might just be a question of getting used to, though. The ship models are all awesome and a beauty to watch, putting the fact aside that some of their designs simply don't meet my personal aesthetic preferences (that Bastion thing is so god-awfully ugly, man! :D) - big thumbs up to the asset people there!

The music, while admittedly not mind-blowing to me, was well put together and presents an organic composition. Do I hear the Fury 3 soundtrack in there? I certainly recognized the rocket launch sound.  ;7 :nod:

The voice-acting was awesome! I totally liked the Command VA. I personally could not distinguish between real voice actors or AI voice actors, and even if I'm absolutely not against using AI voice acting. I should, eventually, try it out for my own mod at some point.

Unfortunately, the campaign has one big weak point and that is the story and, tightly connected to that, the general mission design. This is the same problem I have with the Exile and Shadow Genesis mods: taking vanilla-style missions and inflating their runtime to 20-30 minutes does not improve anything. In fact, it's quite the opposite, at least for me. Length neither creates epicenes nor excitement. It creates monotony. Sitting there and blasting wave after wave after wave of capital ships to pieces for 30 minutes is not interesting.

Now I'm not against having long missions, though I generally see little reason to go beyond the 10-minute mark. Good reasons to do so are interesting character dialogue, world building or - most importantly, perhaps - story development. I was very disappointed to find out, however, that none of these things happen in Inferno.

Characters were kind of there at the beginning, but after a couple of missions your wingmen turn into main campaign type non-personalities except that they have a name. But that's not a big problem to me, actually. Not that I'm against good characters but that's not the reason I play FreeSpace. The biggest problem I had in that regard is that nobody seems to be particularly bothered about the destruction of the Ramayana. I mean, that's the ship we were stationed on? Tens of thousands of our friends and colleagues die and all the reaction we get is "Let's raise a glass"? Hell, even I'm more emotionally in real life and I'm schizoid.

What bothers me more is that we learn next to nothing about the world these people live in. This is a very long campaign and throughout it we learn almost nothing about the Earth Alliance, it's internal structure, it's goals, or motives, except that it seems to be some kind of space-commie dictatorship that starts a war because... why not? I mean, yes it was mentioned that the EA wants immediate reunification with the colonies, but why? What's so important about that that you start a war? What is all this about? We know just as much about this after 32 missions than we already knew after three.

In fact, the final mission is a good representation of all that. This mission is a whopping 35 minutes long and of those the first twelve feel completely redundant. This first part is simply a generic vanilla-style escort mission which has nothing extraordinary to offer. You could completely skip this part and start in the debris field right away without missing anything. Searching the debris was more interesting, but ultimately presents little progress either. We already knew that Ross 128c was devastated and we already suspect that it probably has something to do with a new weapon developed by the EA. The only point where it really gets interesting is the final 5 minutes, but again we don't really learn anything but stop at getting teased.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that every mod has to re-invent the wheel. My own mod certainly is no masterpiece when it comes to creativeness or writing or mission design or whatever. But its 2025 and I think we have to offer more than simply extending what we already had in 1999 to 30 minutes. In that sense, Inferno stays far behind its potential. And that is very, very sad for a quality project like this that shows so much determination in pretty much every other aspect. The team behind this visibly put a lot of hard work in this and I whish more of it had gone to world building and story.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2025, 10:55:44 am by SF-Junky »

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

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Well I appreicate the feedback on the VA,.  I wasn't responsible for anything apart from Ramayana tactical 😅
Campaigns I've added my distinctiveness to-
- Blue Planet: Battle Captains
-Battle of Neptune
-Between the Ashes 2
-Blue planet: Age of Aquarius
-FOTG?
-Inferno R1
-Ribos: The aftermath / -Retreat from Deneb
-Sol: A History
-TBP EACW teaser
-Earth Brakiri war
-TBP Fortune Hunters (I think?)
-TBP Relic
-Trancsend (Possibly?)
-Uncharted Territory
-Vassagos Dirge
-War Machine
(Others lost to the mists of time and no discernible audit trail)

Your friendly Orestes tactical controller.

Secret bomb God.
That one time I got permabanned and got to read who was being bitxhy about me :p....
GO GO DEKKER RANGERSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
President of the Scooby Doo Model Appreciation Society
The only good Zod is a dead Zod
NEWGROUNDS COMEDY GOLD, UPDATED DAILY
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What bothers me more is that we learn next to nothing about the world these people live in. This is a very long campaign and throughout it we learn almost nothing about the Earth Alliance, it's internal structure, it's goals, or motives, except that it seems to be some kind of space-commie dictatorship that starts a war because... why not? I mean, yes it was mentioned that the EA wants immediate reunification with the colonies, but why? What's so important about that that you start a war? What is all this about? We know just as much about this after 32 missions than we already knew after three.

In fact, the final mission is a good representation of all that. This mission is a whopping 35 minutes long and of those the first twelve feel completely redundant. This first part is simply a generic vanilla-style escort mission which has nothing extraordinary to offer. You could completely skip this part and start in the debris field right away without missing anything. Searching the debris was more interesting, but ultimately presents little progress either. We already knew that Ross 128c was devastated and we already suspect that it probably has something to do with a new weapon developed by the EA. The only point where it really gets interesting is the final 5 minutes, but again we don't really learn anything but stop at getting teased.
I imagine that Inferno team wants to explore that in both the last act and the new version of Alliance.

As for the last mission... maybe because I already cleared the Series Resurrecta, but it immediately clicked for me why the Earthers are obsessed with reunification, and what they were trying to do in Ross 128. I don't know if SR is canon to Nostos, though.

 
I imagine that Inferno team wants to explore that in both the last act and the new version of Alliance.

As for the last mission... maybe because I already cleared the Series Resurrecta, but it immediately clicked for me why the Earthers are obsessed with reunification, and what they were trying to do in Ross 128. I don't know if SR is canon to Nostos, though.

Series Resurrecta is actually canon to the Inferno continuity, yes. Players will also learn a little bit more about the EA in R3 and some potential bonus missions.

The plot is vague in many places, for multiple reasons. One of them being that we are working with some missions that are over 20 years old at this point. The core plot for R2 is still very much the same as for R1, which isn't exactly "sophisticated". Much of the worldbuilding is also done via tech entries, which isn't exactly ideal.

 

Offline mr.WHO

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Any ETA on crash fix patch?

 

Offline qweqwe321

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In the process of upload - Knossos isn't playing nice today.

 

Offline qweqwe321

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Inferno 2.3.0 is now out, including a whole bunch of balance adjustments and fixes - including the infamous Tobruk crash.

 

Offline mr.WHO

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Thanks for the patch - Tobruk now runs flawlessly.

 

Offline mr.WHO

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Continue with my playthrough and have two things to report:

"First combat with Shivans" mission really need a checkpoint, especially with the "suprise" at the end.
Having long scripted flying/talking sequence without checkpoint is literally game design sin.
Granted I had to repeat mission only once, but still.


In the next mission (or one of the next) there is an objective to scan Shivan heavy corvette - however, this corvette has very peculiar and narrow angles for scan - because it's moving it always fall short of couple of seconds to finish the scan. I dunno if it's intended, or I'm suppose to dissable it first, but I suggest making scan clerance/angles much wider.

 

Offline mr.WHO

  • 29
OK, now it's time for a critique.


The amount of "plot armor" invulnerability is too abudant, irritating and random - sometimes it's whole ship, sometimes it's an engine component and sometimes ship beams (one Shivan destroyer) - seriously it's really lame to stuck upon this in every second mission or so - i could understand it for plot critical/hero ships, but it's often applied to what I'd describe as grunt/NPC ships.


Persepolis Burning mission is whole another level of bull****, with missing at least one checkpoint (after missile cruiser/corvette group destroyction and going to engage docked Carrier).

Not to mention post-mission failure suggestion just say "use Spells bro" - very useful, I'm using overdrive afterburner like crazy, but I'm still need minutes to traverse between key mission areas.

Edit:
Wow, it looks like it was those two unknown crusiers launching sub-space missile that cause me a headache.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2025, 02:39:54 pm by mr.WHO »

 

Offline mr.WHO

  • 29
OK, I have consistent crash in Persepolis Burning in the phase where enemy carrier undock.

First I though taking out carrier beams before script cause the crash, but it looks like there is a different reason for the crash...

...namely, when you destroy but a one big turret (the "gattling one" that fire like 5 yellow bullets at once) on the station/pier then the game crash :(
« Last Edit: January 19, 2025, 02:56:03 pm by mr.WHO »

 

Offline qweqwe321

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Can you upload the debug log?

 

Offline mr.WHO

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Can you upload the debug log?

If you tell me where to find it, then sure - don't see anything in my Knossos folder that looks like debug log.



Fortunately, I manage to clear mission by not shooting those turrets and making sure none of my wingmen destroy them by accident.


P.S. I find some lore inconsictency in this mission - the Fortress station is in GTA space, but it's EA design/origin - I'm not sure, if EA is capable of building such huge station just under a year (it's like multiple super-destroyers in volume).

 


The amount of "plot armor" invulnerability is too abudant, irritating and random - sometimes it's whole ship, sometimes it's an engine component and sometimes ship beams (one Shivan destroyer) - seriously it's really lame to stuck upon this in every second mission or so - i could understand it for plot critical/hero ships, but it's often applied to what I'd describe as grunt/NPC ships.



I'm curious, do you have some specific examples for this? We have quite a few allied capships that can either die very early in the campaign or accompany you far into it if you manage to defend them. Not sure if that is the case for a lot of enemy capships.
The thing is that most of these ships have plot armor for a reason. I also doubt that we have "invulnerable" plot armor ships anywhere. They tend to either be guardianed or get a substantial amount of armor, once they fall on low HP.

And as for beams being invulnerable, I don't really know any example of that off the top of my head, but if we have guardianed them, then that's usually to prevent a softlock and set up in a way that you don't really have the means to destroy them in the first place.

 

Offline Trivial Psychic

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I'm up to 'Ad Portas' and I'm having trouble surviving that mission.  That said, I've encountered another one of my mission work-around/cheats.  First using Corinthos, I can disarm the 3 RBC platforms quite easily and quickly, but that's hardly a cheat.  Then, after taking out all of the ships attacking the cruisers, you get the order to nano-jump to protect the Sebek, which triggers the next part of the mission, but I decided, 'why do I need to jump over there?  Nothing's gonna happen until I do, so what if I use my time wisely, and try to do as much damage as I can before then?'  So, I tell all of my wingmen to disarm the EA corvette, then fly over and destroy all of the gungir and RBC platforms, just for the kills, then fly through the gate and go for the corvette.  BTW, I swap out the railguns for disruptors, to more easily take out turrets without running out of ammo.  Once the corvette's beams are taken out, I just go for fighters until the Sebek's escort cruisers take out the corvette.  Then, I make a break over to the Arathusa and its escort cruiser, disarm, disable and destroy the cruiser, then disable and disarm the Arathusa.  After that's all done, I trigger the jump.  Having the corvette gone already, prevents all of the bomber and beam fire damage that normally happen, and despite the fact that the messages warning of them still fire, the objectives go complete as soon as they drop.  Then, I high-tail it back to the Arathusa and start going after the bombers as soon as they launch.  There's more than I can handle, but there's enough of my guys that we can nail them all eventually.  Once the Arathusa escort is destroyed, Tau wing will finish it off on their own, so I group all fighters that I can back at the Sebek.  My plan is to disable all of the artillery cruisers before taking out their missile batters (haven't confirmed if you've protected their engines), so they'll be destroyed in stead of escape, but its during the swarm part of that mission, that I get killed, whether I go for the proper way to play the mission, or the cheat.  I'll try again another day.

As a way to prevent my work-around/cheat from being used, I recommend you rig the 'you have jumped' trigger to become valid if you cross over the way I did.  Maybe key it off proximity with the Sebek-side warships.
The Trivial Psychic Strikes Again!

 

Offline mr.WHO

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And as for beams being invulnerable, I don't really know any example of that off the top of my head, but if we have guardianed them, then that's usually to prevent a softlock and set up in a way that you don't really have the means to destroy them in the first place.

Sadly, Inferno dumb at you so many ships that can't even tell which one it was (I don't tend to play with having pen and paper to note this stuff down).

I think it was one of Ravanas that jumps, I'm in fighter protecting something, and command tells me they send bombers to deal with it (I know this doesn't narrow it down much, that's how generic this situation sounds).

The problem is that I have compuslive tick, that every time I see Ravana, I lob Trebuchets at her fangs.
So in Inferno, the moment I saw Ravana, I punched like 10 corinthos at het two man beams immediately, hit afterburner and close in to finish with my guns - to my dissapointment, neither corinthos, not my guns did any damage as both beams stayed at 100%.
I moved to other targets, but saw allied bombers dealing with Ravana (not sure, if it was scripted or that just Ravana had god mode exclusively for attacks from me).

 

Offline Nohiki

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I'm with WHO on this one, this is... immediately noticeable in this one, with protecting heavy beams etc. I didn't notice this in any other campaign, but it just slams me in the eyes in this one. One example I had just now is the heavy beam on the EA final corvette during the siege of the Sol Gate. Another one off the top of my head is engines of the science cruiser in the subspace anomaly depot mission.

To me this isn't infuriating because it's done for storytellyng reasons and whatnot, but because It makes me waste missiles.

 

Offline SF-Junky

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  • Bread can mold, what can you do?
To me this isn't infuriating because it's done for storytellyng reasons and whatnot, but because It makes me waste missiles.
Regarding this, it might be a good idea to set subsystems which are supposed to survive in order to not break a mission untargetable. :)

 

Offline mr.WHO

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My god, those Super-heavy EA bombers are no joke - they managed to tear my poor Banhee before I was able to say WTF.
This is probably the first bomber in my life that I'm afraid of approaching - at my second attempt I used my full banks of corinthos and still managed to take down only 2 out of 4.


As for Trivial Psychic problem with "Ad Portas" - somehow for me the mission was quite swift and easy, so I didn't need to cheese anything.
However, the absurd amount of ships EA throw at you from every direction somehow made that "M" (monitored targets) button, as well as F9-F12 buttons became useless, didn't provide me with any useful information.

Still, despite this, full banks of corinthos, debeam/demissile everything in sight and resupply (at supply ship kept near) made me somehow pass the mission without much of a stress.

 
I'm up to 'Ad Portas' and I'm having trouble surviving that mission.  That said, I've encountered another one of my mission work-around/cheats.  First using Corinthos, I can disarm the 3 RBC platforms quite easily and quickly, but that's hardly a cheat.  Then, after taking out all of the ships attacking the cruisers, you get the order to nano-jump to protect the Sebek, which triggers the next part of the mission, but I decided, 'why do I need to jump over there?  Nothing's gonna happen until I do, so what if I use my time wisely, and try to do as much damage as I can before then?'  So, I tell all of my wingmen to disarm the EA corvette, then fly over and destroy all of the gungir and RBC platforms, just for the kills, then fly through the gate and go for the corvette.  BTW, I swap out the railguns for disruptors, to more easily take out turrets without running out of ammo.  Once the corvette's beams are taken out, I just go for fighters until the Sebek's escort cruisers take out the corvette.  Then, I make a break over to the Arathusa and its escort cruiser, disarm, disable and destroy the cruiser, then disable and disarm the Arathusa.  After that's all done, I trigger the jump.  Having the corvette gone already, prevents all of the bomber and beam fire damage that normally happen, and despite the fact that the messages warning of them still fire, the objectives go complete as soon as they drop.  Then, I high-tail it back to the Arathusa and start going after the bombers as soon as they launch.  There's more than I can handle, but there's enough of my guys that we can nail them all eventually.  Once the Arathusa escort is destroyed, Tau wing will finish it off on their own, so I group all fighters that I can back at the Sebek.  My plan is to disable all of the artillery cruisers before taking out their missile batters (haven't confirmed if you've protected their engines), so they'll be destroyed in stead of escape, but its during the swarm part of that mission, that I get killed, whether I go for the proper way to play the mission, or the cheat.  I'll try again another day.

As a way to prevent my work-around/cheat from being used, I recommend you rig the 'you have jumped' trigger to become valid if you cross over the way I did.  Maybe key it off proximity with the Sebek-side warships.

That's pretty cool, actually. Yes, working with a distance trigger for the first IMjump sequence (or rather if you skip that sequence) would make sense here.